Let's debate stuff

[Lor]

hey hey hey, what happened here? debates are good things as they help your intelligence, yadda yadda yadda. we should pick something else. come on ppl, lets get with the cleverness!

[Robin]

Euthanasia - Personally, oi think that if people are ina horrible state in terms of health, and would rather end their suffering by dying then they should have a right to do so, but i think that if euthanasia was made legal, it would be abused, and misused, to either get rid of people, or people may think that their situation is terrible when they may get better and end up losing their life when had they known, they would have rather kept it.


Abortion - I think that abortion should is fine, as long as it is not abused. I beleive that it is better not to bring a child into the world if they can't bring it up well for reasonabkle, unforseen circumstances, for example, the father walking away. However i think that it should not be used as a method of contraception, and people should not carelessly have sex with the knowledge that if anything goes wrong, they can get an aborton, i think that it should be avoided iuf possible, but should be free to use without any negative sanctions or affects if it is neccesary.



Drugs/Alcohol - I think that this is a very difficult one, as on the one hand, everyone should have a right to choose weather they wish to use drugs and alcohol, but on the other hand i feel that people are often selfish in using drugs as they do not consider the effect that it may have on those around them, or those that care about them. It can affects others in different ways, alcohol can lead to aggression, which can lead to someone physically harming someone, as can many other drugs, which is unfair, as someone ends up hurt because someone else wanted to have some fun, the same goes for driving under the influence of drugs etc...
ANother way is that it can emotionally hurt those that care about the person, as it can make them worry about them, etc etc, which can hurt a lot....I personally feel very split on this as i believe that people should choose what they do with their own body, but i believe that people should consider the thoughts of those around them, and also the effects of their actions on those around them.

Religion - I don't mind if people have personal beliefs, as long as they do not discriminate or repress (or anything along those lines) against those with different views, but i am anti-organised religion, as i think that it most cases, it is either a disguised capitalist way of taking money to use for the leaders' own personal benifit, for example, the prosperity gospel in the USA, where money is taken from believers to be spent in their offices. Or it can be used as an excuse for power, such as the taliban regime.
ALso, most religion completely contradicts itself, for example, in christianity, they suggest that you should "love thy neighbour" which surely means that you should put starving peoiple in third world countries over aesthetically pleasing stained glass windows?
Ok, i haven't really thought about reality tv, so am not going to write any thoughts on that, but their are some brief thoughts on the others.


For new topics, how about:

The 'war on terrorism' 'including the proposed attack on iraq)

gay couple adoption

should Britain have a written constitution?

should Britain have a proportional representation voting system

Nestle, proctor and gamble, smithkling beecham - should we boycott them?

Homelessness - do they deserve help, how should we help them, what should be done about homelessness?


that's about all i can think of right now, i will put my thoughts here sometime in the next few days when my brain is working properly and when i have more time

[Charlie]

Welcome to the board Robin.

i love you fool!

[Lor]

Actually, i agree with everything Robin said so thats not very good debating is it? the alcohol bit sounds as if it was written distinctly for me. hmm....

anyway, i thought i would say that i was having a debate about homeless ppl today and we came to the conclusion that they should be put in prison, not because they are bad or anything, but so then they would have hot meals and a roof over their head and free education (there are librarys and all in prison). This meant that the prisoners would live on the street though, so we decided that we should just kill em. KILL EM ALL.

[Lor]

Nah, seriously we couldnt come up with anything so we just pretended that there wasnt even a debate. then i walked past a homeless person.....

anyway, was just looking at the other ideas for debates and when i looked at the gay couple thing i started thinking about gay sex (as you do) and if the legal age should be lowered. and then i started thinking about the fact that 16 yr olds can legally have sex, but cant legally watch it. whats up with that? theres some more ideas for ya all. lets debate ppl!

[Charlie]

I think we all mature at different ages and can cope with things at different times. In my eyes 16 is pretty damn young for anyone.

[Lor]

i imagine many ppl will feel like they want to kill me after this.... but im saying it anyway.

basically, im quite confused on the whole 'eating meat' thing. it seems to me that we have a wide range of views and and so this is more of a 'meh heh? help me out!' type thing, rather than a debate. i know there are a couple of vegans here and so i am interested in what their views are here i go onto my long speech..

over the years, i seemed to have lost the reason why i gave up meat in the first place. i didnt dislike it, infact i loved kfc, and it wasnt for the animals because, lets face it, animals are slaughtered anyway and me not eating meat isnt gonna save any. (if you ever see how much meat tesco throw away you will see my point. it doesnt matter that less ppl are eating it and more of it is being thrown away, they'll still buy the same amount and just throw more away...). ok, so maybe at first it wasnt the animals as much as the fact that i didnt want to eat any, but as i think more and more into things (which i have been doing) i realise how insignificant i am and how me eating meat isnt going to do anything in the sceme of things. basically, im just thinking constantly at the moment how unimportant everything is and how nothing should really matter.... so why do i spend so much time and effort making sure i dont eat meat? help me explain!!!

[Charlie]

You becames veggie in the first place because you loved animals and the environment and such. I dont know why you're veggie now but its hard to break old traditions I suppose.

[Robin]

you shoudn't have got me started on veggie/veganism...
ok, firstly, not eating meat DOES make a difference, as eventually, the demand is lowered and therefore places DO start buying less in. Also, it creates a market for alternative products, as other things are going to be eaten instead of meat/animal products, such as things like quorn, or more vegetables or veggie burgers, making it easier for other people taht consider veg(etari)anism to actually become vegetarian, therefore eventually, helping less and less animals to be slaughtered.
Secondly, the 'i'm insignificant in the big scheme of things so why should i do certain things' attitudes is the bane of our society. The people that care about anything but themselves are the minority in the world today, and so therefore need to all try to make a difference, and if people are united, they CAN make some kind of difference, so it's stupid to think that we can do absolutely nothing, i'm sure if no one thought like that, and people actually did things rather than avoided doing them as they feel that it won't change anything then we would be living in a better world right now...

and, the reason why people should be vegan/veggie in the first place....well, i don't think it's the killing animals/eating meat that is the issue personally, i woudn't object to people going out and hunting animals, as that is simply the next step of the food chain, and they will have lived a perfectly normal life upto the point that they diel. I think that the way in which animals are treated, and also that we are actually much healthier without meat, and therefore have absoluitely no need to kill animals for food, means that we shoudnt.
i'm sure you are all aware of the barbaric, and cruel way in which animals are treated, in farms, and slaughter houses, ao i need not go into that, but before anyone starts going on about how free range is fine and great, free range means very very little. It means that they have a certain amount of space, not neccesarily a large one, so they still could have a minimal amount of space, and be treated cruely in other ways, such as being beaten, and they will also be treated awfully as they are being killed.

[Lor]

i used to have the 'every little helps' attitude. you know, when i make a difference, even just picking up a piece of screwed up paper or writing smaller to save trees. wonder what happened to that? i think you;re arguements are satisfactory. im quite upset at myself for not rememebering but i just seemed to stop thinking about it. still, despite all that, i didnt even think about touching meat. its as if its a natural reaction. aint that weird?

[Molly]

Please don't lump vegans and vegetarians together, I think they are TOTALLY different, and it just irritates me...

[Lor]

yeah i agree. totally different. wasnt trying to lump them together. sorry if it seemed like i was.

[Dave]

Wow - threads just keep appearing that i never knew existed - I haven't read all of this actually so sorry if i repeat stuff but I wanted to talk about the veggie/vegan-ie bit...

I stopped eating meat mainly because i'm not a big fan and I thought if i can live without why don't i? I love animals so how can I call myself an animal lover if I can eat animals that have been brought up in such a horrific way just to be eaten; what was the point in their life in the first place? People piss me off when they say 'If we all stop eating meat we won't have any sheep/cows etc and we'd have to kill them all anyway" well BOLLOCKS is what I say, we wouldn't breed them in the first place; its not much of a life for them the way it is now.

AS for being vegan, I considered it on several occasions but it would be way too difficult for me as my mum would never tolerate it and i'd probably starve to death and spend all my money on food (that and I really love my DMs...). When i do eat things like eggs tho i try to buy local free range eggs up the road as i feel even free range is a bad thing when it is a big commerccial enterprise. When my mum went away she left a huge box of eggs for us and i went to cook one and saw the lid and it said 'from caged hens' and i couldn't touch them. How can I eat something that specifically says it is from hens kept in cages; i think its bad enough when we eat battery eggs without realising in a cake or such we've bought but to do it in knowing full well what we are doing...

This is my general opinion so ignore it if you wish: I think (most) humans are pretty worthless most of the time; we destroy everything and are pretty crap actually...

As for me being veggie, it has become a (good) habit i can't break; Bits has taken to buying meat so i won't steal her lunch and I honestly don't think i could bring myself to eat it; i feel physically unable...

[Dave]

Oh yeah, by the way, my pony has a synthetic saddle!! Not sure why I'm telling you this but I thought it was kinda relevant when we're talking about vegans and stuff...Ahem.. so my saddle isn't leather... woo... yeah...

[Lor]

yeah i used to be like that, not actually being able to even imagine eating meat. then i did, and i dont want to stop eating it again. its the total opposite to the way i was. i dont quite get it. then again, i dont get anything i do. i think its just the fact that i got bored. and boredom is never good if you're stuck in a school for a couple more years.